Blogging Live: Inside Straight Edge
Good Evening Everyone -
Thanks for joining in for a conversation tonight. We Have Producer David Smith and Associate Producer Lindsay Wile lined up for a good, opening, and productive conversation about a culture in America called Straight Edge.
Thanks for joining look forward to hearing from all of you....
Lets start with an easy one - What was it like filming all over the country with all different slices of sXe culture?
David Smith: Filming sXe around the country showed us how diverse and multi-faceted this movement is. Also how strongly each side of Straight Edge feels about the way they approach this idea. Most importantly, though, it gave us a window into growing up in America right now -- a complex, sometimes baffling, often alienating experience. It was interesting to see an alternative in Straight Edge and interesting to see where it came from and where it seemed to be heading. There is no one answer.
rob says: Thurston Moore (the narrator, of sonic youth fame) is straight edge? anyone have any credible info on that?
David Smith: Thurston Moore is not Straight Edge, but he was around during the formative days of it and knows all the major players. The music scene was tightly knit.
How did you determine which groups to interview?
David Smith:The way we found our groups and kids was organic. One thing led to another. By talking with one group we were inevitably brought to another. We started at Edge Day, outside Boston, but we knew we wanted to cover territory across the country, so we asked and we sought and we found. It was mostly a game of chance -- but with such a big, diverse subject, you just have to jump in. Obviously, we couldn't cover every side of Straight Edge, so we tried to find different groups and also how these communities were dealing with this youth movement. The internet was indispensable, too!
Jim- Any bands featured in this?
Lindsay Wile: The crew was able to attend Edgefest 2007 shows in Haverhill, MA, and with the help of xAFBx musicians, film a second show in Reno, Nevada. Bands featured in the film include Verse, The First Step, Have Heart, xAFBx, and xBarcadiax.
What was it like for you to be filming all of these bands? Any memorable moments?
David Smith: I would say the most memorable moment was watching the synchronized karate-like moves of the Reno Straight Edge show. It was like nothing I had ever seen before. Almost ritual in its exactness.
Sarah: Did i miss the numbers - how many people are estimated to be in straight edge?
Lindsay Wile: Since its inception in the early 1980's, the movement has expanded around the globe, counting upward of tens of thousands of young people among its members. Though like any youth movement, interest in straight edge ebbs and flows, the number of kids involved fluctuates. But it is nearly impossible to count the exact number of edge kids.
What was the most difficult scene to film?
David Smith: Filming the Edge Day concert was tough -- tiny room packed with wildly jumping kids, sweat, feet and hands flying, temperatures up past 100 degrees and loud music! There was just no easy way to film it -- at the same time, it was one of my favorite scenes and my first introduction into the music and scene of Straight Edge. So I had a good time, even if it was physically demanding. I guess that's the point!
Ken: Do you like that music? Is there any rivalry in the punk rock scene between the straight edge crowd and the more hardcore/Sex Pistols like crowd.
Clearly i'm showing my lack of knowledge on punk rock - but interesting to see how involved Straight Edge is in that music scene.
David Smith: Probably someone more familiar with the punk scene should answer this one! I was really impressed by the music -- by its physical quality, its urgency. It was interesting that the message of Straight Edge is delivered largely through the music. For that reason, I think there are tensions between the Straight Edge music scene and the on-Straight Edge hardcore that it grew out of. I've heard of the groups fighting each other. But I also think the music is very related and universally liked.
mrm0to: Did the producers try and interview Ian Mackaye or any of the other old DC punks? Did they refuse?
David Smith: We talked extensively with Ian. He did not want to be interviewed for the show, but he enlightened me on the history and his take on Straight Edge. He was a great teacher -- I can't say I was the best student! But he gave me a broad view and helped me put a lot fo what we were filing in context. I'm grateful for his input.
How tense was it filming with FSU? Any friction between you and the crew with any members?
David Smith: The members we interviewed made us feel safe and taken care of in their presence. They've grown up, are heading toward other goals now, and were very articulate about who they were. The tension came from the degree to which they could or couldn't talk about everything they may or may not have been involved in.
How was it filming with Jeremy Nelson? I realize that you had only little time with Jeremy, but how would you characterize his transformation from once a member to a straight edge community to becoming a police officer?
David Smith:I think Jeremy's transformation is remarkable for the insight it gives him to both sides of the story. I think he didn't like the way he saw Straight Edge changing and that was part of what brought him to make a different choice. But his roots are still in Straight Edge. He considers it a part of what formed him as a human being. Moving over to the law enforcement side has not been easy. Ironically, I think he gets a lot of flak from his police colleagues -- as much as he does from the Straight Edge kids he used to be with. So in a way, he is caught between the two.
Lindsay, David - Any Tattoos to match the people you interviewed?
Lindsay Wile: No tattoos to match, but there definitely were some cool ones.
Any last minute parts of filming you want our audience to know about?
David Smith:Of course we couldn't capture the entire pluralistic world of Straight Edge. But my feeling is that there is a debate that is happening within Straight Edge and within the communities where Straight Edge lives. That debate can get loud, get unreasonable, get extreme on all sides. By the end of filming all of us making the show were left with ambivalent feelings about whether or not Straight Edge deserves the labels that fly around it. Clearly the large majority of Straight Edge is a positive thing for kids. But as Ross Haenfler told us, there can be room for debate and discussion about identity within Straight Edge. That's a healthy thing. Mostly, making this film helped show me that growing up in America in 2008 is not easy. It's complex. And Straight Edge is part of that complexity.
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97 Comments
Do we just submit questiosn here? Did i miss the numbers - how many people are estimated to be in straight edge?
this is awesome.
Do you like that music? Is there any rivalry in the punk rock scene between the straight edge crowd and the more hardcore/Sex Pistols like crowd. Clearly i'm showing my lack of knowledge on punk rock - but interesting to see how involved Straight Edge is in that music scene.
Did the producers try and interview Ian Mackaye or any of the other old DC punks? Did they refuse?
Thanks for putting this together. I think it is an important element of society that is not discussed often enough. I believe sXe saved my life and I would not be where I am today without it. I think it is important to also look at the people that remain drug and alcohol free for their entire lives. I am a 27 year old professional and I still consider myself sXe. It has shaped my life. Thanks again.
This is actually quite sad. In all my years, and there have been many, I never envisioned straight edge as a gang. It was just an adjective and a short way of saying that you chose not to imbibe. Watching this documentary I have come to the realization that the media and others that need to be a part of the herd have manipulated a simple and honest idea and made it a joke.
im going to be honest, so far this blows. i think its focusing on the bad. which thinking about it, if you didnt show that itd be pretty boring. we're just normal people that choose not to drink and stuff.
i hope you show more stuff later in the program than the violence that has been caused in the name of sxe.
I have to say, so far, so good - the film is well balanced. I can only speak for me, that means a lot to someone like me, the straight edge movement is my life.
why did you not include the no promiscuity rule? you said no drinking, no smoking, no drugs, yet everyone also includes no promiscuous behavior. was it too much for "nat geo?" props for showing verse, they deserve the press. as for fsu, they have been a plague to the hardcore scene for awhile.
I am unimpressed by the straight edge movement... it seems to be another expression of a disenfranchised youth overindulged by the previous generation... if not for the proliferation of the prescription drug era there would be no measurable increase or decrease of "illegal drug" and/or "social drinking" indulgence in this millenium baby age.
Are most "straight edge" people tied into this punk scene? It seems to me like most people who are drug/alcohol free are probably athletes, accountants, parents, Christians, or members of any other subgroup of American society. Can't you be straight edge without the black clothing, busted haircuts, unskilled musicians, and hatred toward American culture as a whole?
Uhhh....problem.
FSU has nothing to do with straightedge? Although a violent gang created to run the nazis out of the boston punk scene is admirable in its purpose, very very few members of FSU are straightedge.
Why is this entire documentary phrased in terms of "membership?" It's an idea, and there are extremists. This gross assumption is comparable to calling or suggesting that all muslims (or even SOME rather than an extremely small percentage) are terrorists.
I used to be straight edge. I wish it was shown that one of the traits of being stright edge is fighting racism.
Wow. Straight edge as a gang? What the heck? How does a philosophical idea that is fundamentally a persona choice become a freaking gang? These "gang" members are nothing more than sheep seeking acceptance. They need a new hobby. They should have talked to Kent McClard of Ebullition Records. His compilation "XXX: Some Ideas are Poisonous" was probably the best "straight edge" release in the 90's. It really combated the meat head mentality that you are seeing on this documentary.
VP of discipline? That guys an idiot - bunch of people wearing the same shirt is trouble? Look out for those Polo gangs
I am glad that the movement is finally getting some press time but it is sad that it is focused on the gang/negative aspect though. I am very glad that people are living clean but I wish the gang stuff would just go away.
I have been straight edge for three years (it is tough living in MN b/c no one knows about it) and have talked to tons of people about it, even did a speech on it in my junior year speech class. I have turned about 5 or 6 people onto it including my younger brother. I am proud to say I am 18 and Straight Edge.
How about covering some of the girls/women involved in the scene?
Tiffany - I'm glad that straight edge is a positive influence in your life, however, you are exhibiting everything this documentary is showing. You "turned" 5 or 6 people straight edge? Isn't that the definition of gang related activity? I don't think this documentary is using the term 'gang' as what you typically think of a gang, but a group of individuals banning together for a common cause.
Did you discuss any of the murders that FSU members are currently charged with across the nation? Did you ever take the time to ask how many or what percentage of FSU members were actually straightedge before choosing to put them in the forefront?
Was there ever any mention of Earth Crisis or any of the militant days of the 90s as being the true source of the current militant side?
Why did you not feature actual straightedge gangs or did they not want to participate?
maybe you should do some more research before portraying straight edge culture in this way. once again, mainstream media attempts to understand an underground movement and gets it completely wrong. way to go, idiots.
get your facts right before portraying straight edge culture. Once again mainstream media attempts to understand an underground movement and gets it totally wrong. Way to go.
So I'm in a gang...cool?
Some idiots need to be a part of some group. Why didn't they mention early practitioners of "Hate Edge" like Slap Shot? Did I miss the history portion? What about Vegan Reich and those guys. Indiana had one of those goofy gang movements in the 90s. Who are they defending themselves from? Who is attacking them? They sound like skinheads to me.
I'm not surprised that people close to the topic may think its negative. I know nothing about straight edge - but its not coming off to me negative at all. People in Straight edge can't look at the big picture and see it from others eyes, that's common with any belief. I'm seeing a few idiots ruin the image for others - but the most part, striaght edge seems pretty basic to me. You guys in straight edge need to relax a bit and not assume how the rest of us will take things. Quit blaming everyone else for your own image issues - its not the media's fault - its the idiot kids who get into trouble
F.Y.I. Straight edge turning completely corruupt is not a new concept. Both the the Crips of L.A. to the GDs of Chicago started out as positive organizations and were converted into violent criminal gangs. It depends mostly on which way the leadership takes the organization!!!! REMEMBER YOUR HISTORY!
I think the way that you represented FSU as being affiliated with straight edge was misguided to say the least. There are many members of FSU that are affiliated with drug and alcohol usage, were you aware of this?
Also Kris,
Tiffany didn't use her english properly so you turn it around on her? Fucks up with that? Sorry I didn't know this was an english subject too.
Also Kris,
Tiffany didn't use her english properly so you turn it around on her? Fucks up with that? Sorry I didn't know this was an english class too.
Would be interesting to hear what Ian MacKaye would say if he were interviewed for this.
"Straight Edge" has morphed in to an excuse to act a certain way. To me, being straight edge meant falling in to the "unclassifyable" category within the standard cliques that people associate themselves with. Now, it's something completely different, which doesn't bother me much. Just be and think for yourself — and if that means a drug-free, positive way of life then that great.
a gang ??? wow.. what a funny doc... ats some hardcore kids, thats it...
This wasn't a straight edge doc, but a sensationalistic gang expose. I expect to see this schlocky, badly done yellow journalism on daytime TV.
What would MacKaye say? He's expressed numerous times that it was simply a personal choice. And what a bummer about Thurston Moore narrating. What a blow to his clout.
james - you just said soemthing great - ORGANIZATIONS.
sxe is NOT an organization. its a personal life choice. thats it. thats why we (sxe people) dont like this, cause its making it seem like an organization. i decided to do this for me. thats it. it wasnt for a group or anything and thats what 99% of us went through as well.
call it how you will. say we see it differently cause we are that way etc etc etc but the truth is is that we're living it and know the real story behind it.
'two sides of sxe'
no, theres no sides of it, its just living a certain way.
i think they are making it more than it is. and they really shouldve done more research.
im a professional, i wear no sxe merch anymore, i just live a certain way of life. but i aaw no one like that on the doc.
its just bogus to me.
They kid at the end said all that needed to be said. He would "let down" others. SXE is for him is not a personal choice. It is nothing more than peer pressure. The young kids at the end are just followers. They just followed something that was once was a philosophical choice. Those are the types of kids that are unbridled fanatics at anything they do. Again, just another example of how weak minded and afraid of nonconformity many are.
Why was the section with the three vegan, anarchist, straight-edge kids not shown on the show? I understand time was a big consideration, but it was a great segment and showed a radically different side of straight-edge than was presented anywhere else during the show.
I'm 40 yrs old and was very involved in the S/X scene in the 80's.
I now it shouldn't suprise me but, because a handful of kids act like idiots, a whole subculture is labeled a dangerous gang? I guess some things will never change. Mr. producer a bit more history: 80's D.C., N.Y. and Boston would have put things in perspective for those who have no clue about this life style. If I didn't know better I would think crazy "militant" straight edge kids were competing with The Bloods for turf across the country.
Signed,
Pissed off old guy, who feels a diservice has been done to what for the most part is a positive movement.
will this documentary be available for purchase in the future?
first of all FSU is not a straight edge group which is what it was shown to be.
Boston Beatdown was also not a straight edge thing. just a bunch of hardcore kids.
It was a good docu. wasnt as bad as i thought. but there were many mistakes made throughout the docu.
I have to say, after watching that I don't know a thing about "straight edge". I'm approaching 40 years old and in high school I suppose we considered ourselves straight edge, but, it was just a song and it was just a personal choice shared by a few friends in high school, mostly to get far away from the jocks and everything they stood for. Growing up in DC, I think we had a different view of things and maybe saw things more clearly. It is for sure, now I don't see things that clear at least like these gang members. I just had no idea. I was talking to my teenager the other day about ways to say no if pressured and mentioned straight edge and if that is still something kids know about.... maybe I made a mistake.
That was ridiculous. Let's hope the rest of the media doesn't catch on.
This show was complete garbage. You talked to all the wrong people. Those arnt hardcore kids, they are jocks who call themselves edge. They dont belong to my scene, and they never will. This movement is ALL ABOUT being positive. Once you chang that you DO NOT represent edge anymore, no matter what you or your tattoos say.
I'm still in the middle of watching this but so far it seems like a documentary made to explain the parents why they shouldn't let their kids "join" straightedge. Including clueing them in on the "lingo".
For anyone who truely wants to know what straight edge is about, please don't take this documentary as an acurate portrayal.
Staight edge is a personal choice, a personal ethic, that lots of different kinds of people embrace. Scenes vary greatly from city to city, and range anywhere from pretty rough and violent, to SO passive that kids won't even dance at shows because they are too worried about it getting out of control.
It is unfortunate that the directors chose to focus on old news from boston and utah instead of focusing on some of the more current or neutral aspects of the scene.
Most sxe kids aren't "posi" or "militant" but somewhere in between... its not some clearly drawn line.
And putting in FSU? They aren't a "straight edge gang"... why make them such a focus?
I was dissapointed that the vegan sxe clip I heard would be in this documentary wasn't included...
Anyway, I've been sxe 10 years and I was hoping to not watch yet another documentary about salt lake kids carving x's in peoples backs... at least they didnt show the carl on geraldo clip...
Wasted hour of my life
I'm still in the middle of watching this but so far it seems like a documentary made to explain the parents why they shouldn't let their kids "join" straightedge. Including clueing them in on the "lingo".
For anyone who truely wants to know what straight edge is about, please don't take this documentary as an acurate portrayal.
Staight edge is a personal choice, a personal ethic, that lots of different kinds of people embrace. Scenes vary greatly from city to city, and range anywhere from pretty rough and violent, to SO passive that kids won't even dance at shows because they are too worried about it getting out of control.
It is unfortunate that the directors chose to focus on old news from boston and utah instead of focusing on some of the more current or neutral aspects of the scene.
Most sxe kids aren't "posi" or "militant" but somewhere in between... its not some clearly drawn line.
And putting in FSU? They aren't a "straight edge gang"... why make them such a focus?
I was dissapointed that the vegan sxe clip I heard would be in this documentary wasn't included...
Anyway, I've been sxe 10 years and I was hoping to not watch yet another documentary about salt lake kids carving x's in peoples backs... at least they didnt show the carl on geraldo clip...
Wasted hour of my life
I understand the principal of trying to spread the message of edge, but it makes it out to be that this is all a gang. Gangs and crews form not of straight edge, but of people in and out of edge cause they're bored and/or want to be cool. I'm straight edge and I've never even been in any fights or anything that's been violent related to straight edge. Maybe it's where I'm from, but nothing really happens around here like that much. Maybe a couple of times, but not like this makes it out to be. I don't want everyone thinking that we're all in gangs or something, cause most of my edge friends aren't.
I have two questions.
Did you ever consider looking at the ways the struggle continues into adulthood. Staying drug and alcohol free isn't just for rebellious adolescents.
Throughout the making of this documentary did you find many females involved in this movement?
Thanks!
Egad -- as a documentary titled "Inside Straight Edge" it was a TERRIBLE documentary! Clearly, Smith and his crew were much more comfortable hanging out with cops and authority figures than giving any sort of attention to the range of sXe. It *specifically* focused on violence and gang mentality. There was no mention of vegetarianism, veganism, krishna consciousness, anti-fur, sober venues, etc. It was so obviously one-sided for the last 3/4 of the program, it should've been called "Inside Gangs: A Focus on Straight Edge."
Imagine if they focused on a bunch of posi kids drinking cool aid for one hour and pointing fingers in the air. That would have been a yawn fest! Boooooring. I thought the show was funny (and a bit sad). This show has some great one liners. This is nothing more than what the media did in the mid 80s, portraying every punk with a shaved head as a "skinhead" making parents think their kids were nazis! I wouldn't get too upset with the show.
the producers couldn't even answer ignorant or basic knowledge questions on this blog! i think if "nat geo" wanted to appeal to the same youthful audience they are trying attract, they should let a director who is immersed in the culture make the film you show on your program. instead of throwing an idea at a staff member and learn the basic from ian, why not take a DIY documentarian and fund their project to make the well informed film that won't warrant all this criticism from the sxe culture.
i live in virginia beach, va and growing up in my neighborhood probably half my friends were gang or drug related, the other half in the hardcore/punk scene, of which probably half of those were sxe. we knew of sxe gangs in the major cities as far back as 15 years ago, half of whom were our friends and didn't care whether or not we were sxe or not. the ones we didn't get along with were more likely the facist extremists. we also knew at the time of sxe gangs in salt lake city doing drive bys on bars and beating wino's to death in tampa bay. if the producers had spent a little more time researching the subject they may have been able to create a more informative and unbiased documentry, instead of one that came off as a day late, a dollar short and not being able to see much further than the camera lens it was shot from.
I found this incredibly disheartening.
A hardcopy expose similar to this came out about 6 years ago and my aunt saw it and the next time she saw me she said "you're in that gang! I know about you!" hahaha it took me like an hour to convince her I hadn't joined a cult. Than I carved an x in her back and blew up her car cause it had leather seats...
(Note to fbi monitoring all internet activity relating to the "sxe gang movement and vegan terrorism" that last part was a joke)
I give natgeo props for at least talking about a positive side to straight edge, even if it was only for about a quarter of the production.
I can only imagine how hard it must have been to choose what scenes to include and what to edit out, but how can you call this an objective portrayal of straight edge when you leave out an entire segment of it's population. Girls.
There was not one interview, mention, or image of the women of the scene. Shame on you.
Maybe if you had cut down on the sensational gang/violence footage you would have been able to create a more accurate portrayal of straight edge and the INDIVIDUALS that make up the scene.
All of us, even the 30 somethings, professionals, and straight edge parents.
Great documentary! I have some questions:
Does religion play any role in the values of these teens?
Why no/so few females?
Any support from community organizations...?
Is there a consistent "creed" for the group?
Let me know.
Dang -- so many good points. Where were the female sXe kids? There have been all-female sXe bands. There are religous factions of sXe: krishna, Christian, and beyond, and bands that espouse those aspects.
Karen: you should probably ask the kids posting replies on here instead of the directors if you are truly intrested since they (the directors) have clearly proven they don't know what they are talking about...
Religion: some kids are christian, some are krishna, some are muslim, some are athiests, some are mormon, some are agnostic. No religion doesn't play a role other than sxe values may coinside with someones personal religious beliefs.
Like most heavy music scenes it is heavily dominated by males... just because it is less socialy acceptable for women to express themselves through heavy music or what may be viewed as "violent" dancing. There are a ton of women involved in hardcore and punk and who are also sxe. Look at the sisterhood site...
Support from community usually would come in the form of a teen center letting us put on shows. That's about it.
And as far as a creed... like a motto? I don't really understand the question. There are a ton of commonly quoted lyrics but no motto.
It isn't a club, or a group... its just a label to describe a choice to live a clean lifestyle.
things that i caught that were total crap
14 minutes of a positive segment and then all the rest is negative.
FSU is straight edge? thats news to me.
Boston Beatdown was all straight edge? news to me too.
burning down mcdonalds.....i didnt know ALF was a straight edge gang to. but i guess since FSU is then ALF must be as well.
many, many mistakes.
Mass media focusing on an essentially underground culture bombs big time.
Way to interview and follow around one of the most negative Straight Edge bands out right now. Why not interview Verse, and Have Heart, instead of just showing them playing. What happened to the clip of of the Vegan anarchist?
This documentary was TERRIBLE. Straight Edge CAN NOT be captured in a piddly 45 minutes.
Fail.
Do your own research people! That's the biggest thing. National Geographic may be great at telling us what the blankety blank tribe of eastern New Guinea does in a typical day, but they're apparently no better at talking about sXe than 20/20 was.
Oh AFB, Reno sXe. What would Kevin Seconds say..
google compassion media- the edge project- I have a feeling what they're working on will be way better than what natgeo put together...
In response to "BobbyG," straight edge is exclusive to the hardcore/punk scene.
I hope this program re-airs. I didn't find out about it until just now.
Momo: you didn't miss anything
This was a pretty big load of crap.
They focus on Posi for all of like 5 minutes, and go straight into beatings and assumed straight edge related firebombings.
Its really pretty disappointing to see something I hold dear be trashed like that.
Although it does bug me alot to see so many fake edge kids these days claiming it because they think theyll look cool. Then they drop it soon after because they think theyll look cooler with a cig in their hand.
Having been in the scene for well over 20 years, I have to say that this show (I'm not calling it a documentary) made me sad. How things have changed.
MoMo, sXe isn't exclusive to Hardcore/punk. I've known kids who aren't into hardcore at all but they're still edge. It Just so happens that 98% of Edge kids happen to be into Hardcore/punk. They do tend to go hand in hand, but it isn't exclusive.
P.S. - Its not a gang either. And MoMo your classification of esclusivity makes it sound that way. Ive got a couple sXe friends who hardly ever listen to HxC.
This honestly made me somewhat embarrassed to be edge. Most of the documentary focused on the hardlines who give the scene a bad name. I really wish there was more of the straightedge vegan kids in the documentary. It seemed to focus on the negativity and take away from the posi aspect of edge, and make people think that everyone is so violent. I think it misrepresented edge for the sake of ratings. I was so excited to watch it after seeing the clip of the xvx kids, but then I was just sad that people view me in this way.
One thing I still dont get is the whole vegetarian/vegan ties to sXe.
I think thats pretty well retarded.
It is simple really, straightedge is another form of self liberation , and for those of us that believe animals have value above just serving humans needs , we believe they to should be liberated .
Freedom for all living, human and non-human
p.s freedom for those who have mental illness's as well
1. Agree or not, straight edge grew out of the early DC hardcore scene. Being drug free is for anyone, straight edge is our thing.
2. FSU began with all straight edge member and thus was known as a straight edge crew. Not so much anymore.
3. Do you really care if the mainstream media puts a negative tone on straight edge and all associated?
I didn't get into punk rock and hardcore because my parents approved. I don't want to discuss the show I went to on Friday with my boss on Monday.
We existed before they took notice and we will continue to do so after they stop caring.
dani's and others post below cracks me up. You don't want a documentary - you want a propaganda piece on why straight edge is all positive. Its not, I'm sorry to say. Compassion media is making your propaganda piece, that's fine- but this was a good, balanced documentary. Problem is for those in straight edge, if it doesn't meet your needs, its therefore crap. Yet, everyone seems to have a different opinion on that - and that's the point. There are negative aspects historically and currently in straight edge - this show didn't overly focus on them, in my opinion, but it has to show them. At the end of the day, you guys need to learn to relax - you take yourselves way to seriously.
dani:
the producers couldn't even answer ignorant or basic knowledge questions on this blog! i think if "nat geo" wanted to appeal to the same youthful audience they are trying attract, they should let a director who is immersed in the culture make the film you show on your program. instead of throwing an idea at a staff member and learn the basic from ian, why not take a DIY documentarian and fund their project to make the well informed film that won't warrant all this criticism from the sxe culture.
jeff - a documentary like this obviously addresses a mainstream audience and thus has to cover populist issues such as "sxe gangs" and "militance", whereas a smaller DIY production has no line producer limiting what will be aired.
60min is a way too small format to cover a diverse subculture such as straight edge, so it will only be able to touch on all the 'spectacular subjects' that are of interest to a national geographic audience, whereas any longer format would have the chance to cover each subject more deeply. many important issues such as the role of women, promiscuity and activism were left out completely.
so i suggest you wait until you've seen the "edge project" documentary before you label it as "propaganda piece", which i am sure it is not, since it sounded quite reflected to me. plus they've talked to a broader variety of straight edgers and 'scenesters' such as cappo, buechner, mackaye, mclard etc and i think its quite interesting to hear what their picture of straight edge is today and how it changed over the years from their very own perspective.
Just as my parents were finally understanding straight edge after 6 years, you have came and destroyed that all. I have never been in a gang, I have never thrown a fist, I go to shows in Reno and have never seen any of those kids, nor have I seen any ever mosh with a hockey mask. You guys hung out with the plauge of hardcore. I am really dissapointed on this whole show.
Last night I sat in a room full of fellow edgemen and laughed the majority of the way through this "documentary". Being right there at Edge Day and having at your disposal a ton of potential quality interviews and insights, I find it hard to understand why you chose only to spend the first 10 minutes of the program on this part of the culture. Do some research, look at the roots of straight edge. Youth of Today, Minor Threat, Judge, Uniform Choice are bands that should have been talked about. "Hate" edge is a joke to be laughed about between true edge men. Most of the crimes mentioned occurred a decade ago. And kids in hockey masks? You've got to be kidding me. This is much like representing the entire Baptist church by interviewing Fred Phelps. What a joke. Thank you National Geographic for thoroughly embarrassing me with this horrible excuse for a documentary.
i really didnt like the way you guys portrayed straight edge at all. 10 minutes of positive kids having fun and then the rest was a bunch of kids giving all of us a bad name. militant kids are a joke. straight edge is about bettering yourself as a human and doing whats right because we want to rebel against a nation thats killing itself. AFB sucks anyway. have you ever read there lyrics? dudes are jokes. I got respect for them but you cant beat the crap out of people who arent straight edge that does nothing but make people hate straight edge kids, the scene in north carolina is actually really good. we dont put up with that tough guy crap. its a family out here. i do agree that you shouldnt let someone stomp in your face but you also shouldnt provoke crap because someone disagrees with your beliefs. The only time there should be violence is when you or you close friends are in danger. you should have interviewed some good positive straight edge bands or bands that have a good message have heart, youth of to day, Xlooking forwardX, good clean fun, go it alone, gorilla biscuits, verse, bitter end the list just goes on.
but instead you have to show this brutal ass scene with kids who listen to liferuiner and beat the crap out of each. first off.
these kids are a joke. you got a mind use it.
i dont agree with drugs at shows period. thats when people deserve to get there ass beat is when they are sniffing lines in the bathroom or trying to smoke out the place.
The only saving graces of this documentary were the clips of Edge Day and Minor Threat. Stop trying to sensationalize the choices that people make and turning them into something they are not.
girls cant be straight edge.
First off these are opinions, and they may be different than yours, respect it. I respected yours.
what they talked about i think was pretty good, but thats just me.
It's considered a gang because its a group of people; they all got the words straight edge tattooed on them, so it causes speculation for others that, you are in fact in a gang or
organization.
definition = "Gang"- a group of persons having informal and usually close social relations.
i assume that sXe kids that always hangout is a 'gang'
but type in gang in a thesaurus and you get words with both positive and negative connotations. (but thats opinion based)
Since some of the sxe kids got into a couple fights with other "gangs" because they were standing up for their beliefs, they are now known as a gang. But in fact there are groups of sXe kids that don't fight and sXe that do.
Just like a Muslims. A LOT of us think they are ALL terrorists but I doubt they all are. there are the ones that are peaceful and cause no harm and the ones that are violent and kill. And because of that the small 5% of them, it gives Muslims a bad name. so i bet filming a documentary about Muslims would just be as bad as making a documentary for sXe kids. because most likely the creators will make a more negative image amongst Muslims than they really are
just like many other "organizations"
and regardless everything. society loves negative news. It travels faster than positive news, because no one cares about positive things; they assume its alright.
so just Look at society, really how much News today is about the positive aspects?
I AM IN A GANG!
I think it's really great that straightedge is now becoming more public. More people should join the movement.
I think it's really great that straightedge is now becoming more public. More people should join the movement.
Straight Edge is B.S. Its alternative street violence. If u need to be apart of a group then u r weak! Grow up travel the world -- So do straight edge people beat up their parents if they smoke or drink-- what a hypocrite--
Straight Edge is B.S. Its alternative street violence. If u need to be apart of a group then u r weak! Grow up travel the world -- So do straight edge people beat up their parents if they smoke or drink-- what a hypocrite--
I was straight edge back in in the 80s\90s and was very interested in watching this documentary to see how SE has changed since then. Wow, I guess it became a gang.
There was, and I'm sure there still is, so many different aspects to this subculture that weren't even MENTIONED. The DIY aspect of SE just isn't as interesting as half ass gang graffiti. The music that is at the heart of this movement was only portrayed as a venue for gang violence.
And why was there not a single female shown? I guess there aren't too many of them out there joining straight edge gangs to beat people up.
I'm glad I came here and read the posts by the people who are SE. Now I know that this documentary was complete BS. There is already a show on THC called Gangland. That is where this documentary fits.
if you guys are gonna research stright edge then get your facts right
ive been associated with punk, hardcore, and straight edge for a number of years now and what you guys are doing is making it seem like we are bad people
the fact is that violence is everywhere in our society, not just in hardcore
Get your facts stright:
Yes there are crews in hardcore but they dont go around jumping people for fun. They dont carry guns, dont rob people, and dont kill people, and dont do things that gangs do. Not all crews are straight edge based and this is true of FSU, THEY ARE NOT A STRAIGHT EDGE CREW! Some of the founders of FSU might have been striaght edge but they are not a straight edge crew. A crew is not a gang like i said, they are just a group of really close firends that go to shows, but thnx to people in Reno, SLC, and other places its now considered a gang.
And as far as the fights, its human nature to help one of your friends who is getting jumped by 8 other guys. And its really hard to defend yourself when its only 2 of you and 8 of the other people. Crews got each others back just they way any other true friends would but that dosent make them a gang and that dosent mean they go around jummping people for no reason
And another thing, there isnt 2 sides to hardcore. Wheather your posi or not, at the end of the day your still into hardcore, you still go to hardcore shows, and your still part of hardcore.
Straight Edge is a life style, its not an orginization
So if you wanna know more about straight edge, hardcore, or punk then look into it for yourself and dont let the media tell you what its about.
Id like to thank national geographic for giving what i live for a bad name,and just ruining our name
xXx
if you guys are gonna research stright edge then get your facts right
ive been associated with punk, hardcore, and straight edge for a number of years now and what you guys are doing is making it seem like we are bad people
the fact is that violence is everywhere in our society, not just in hardcore
Get your facts stright:
Yes there are crews in hardcore but they dont go around jumping people for fun. They dont carry guns, dont rob people, and dont kill people, and dont do things that gangs do. Not all crews are straight edge based and this is true of FSU, THEY ARE NOT A STRAIGHT EDGE CREW! Some of the founders of FSU might have been striaght edge but they are not a straight edge crew. A crew is not a gang like i said, they are just a group of really close firends that go to shows, but thnx to people in Reno, SLC, and other places its now considered a gang.
And as far as the fights, its human nature to help one of your friends who is getting jumped by 8 other guys. And its really hard to defend yourself when its only 2 of you and 8 of the other people. Crews got each others back just they way any other true friends would but that dosent make them a gang and that dosent mean they go around jummping people for no reason
And another thing, there isnt 2 sides to hardcore. Wheather your posi or not, at the end of the day your still into hardcore, you still go to hardcore shows, and your still part of hardcore.
Straight Edge is a life style, its not an orginization
So if you wanna know more about straight edge, hardcore, or punk then look into it for yourself and dont let the media tell you what its about.
Id like to thank national geographic for giving what i live for a bad name,and
ruining our name
xXx
if you guys are gonna research stright edge then get your facts right
ive been associated with punk, hardcore, and straight edge for a number of years now and what you guys are doing is making it seem like we are bad people
the fact is that violence is everywhere in our society, not just in hardcore
Get your facts stright:
Yes there are crews in hardcore but they dont go around jumping people for fun. They dont carry guns, dont rob people, and dont kill people, and dont do things that gangs do. Not all crews are straight edge based and this is true of FSU, THEY ARE NOT A STRAIGHT EDGE CREW! Some of the founders of FSU might have been striaght edge but they are not a straight edge crew. A crew is not a gang like i said, they are just a group of really close firends that go to shows, but thnx to people in Reno, SLC, and other places its now considered a gang.
And as far as the fights, its human nature to help one of your friends who is getting jumped by 8 other guys. And its really hard to defend yourself when its only 2 of you and 8 of the other people. Crews got each others back just they way any other true friends would but that dosent make them a gang and that dosent mean they go around jummping people for no reason
And another thing, there isnt 2 sides to hardcore. Wheather your posi or not, at the end of the day your still into hardcore, you still go to hardcore shows, and your still part of hardcore.
Straight Edge is a life style, its not an orginization
So if you wanna know more about straight edge, hardcore, or punk then look into it for yourself and dont let the media tell you what its about.
Id like to thank national geographic for giving what i live for a bad name,and
ruining our name
xXx
if you guys are gonna research stright edge then get your facts right
ive been associated with punk, hardcore, and straight edge for a number of years now and what you guys are doing is making it seem like we are bad people
the fact is that violence is everywhere in our society, not just in hardcore
Get your facts stright:
Yes there are crews in hardcore but they dont go around jumping people for fun. They dont carry guns, dont rob people, and dont kill people, and dont do things that gangs do. Not all crews are straight edge based and this is true of FSU, THEY ARE NOT A STRAIGHT EDGE CREW! Some of the founders of FSU might have been striaght edge but they are not a straight edge crew. A crew is not a gang like i said, they are just a group of really close firends that go to shows, but thnx to people in Reno, SLC, and other places its now considered a gang.
And as far as the fights, its human nature to help one of your friends who is getting jumped by 8 other guys. And its really hard to defend yourself when its only 2 of you and 8 of the other people. Crews got each others back just they way any other true friends would but that dosent make them a gang and that dosent mean they go around jummping people for no reason
And another thing, there isnt 2 sides to hardcore. Wheather your posi or not, at the end of the day your still into hardcore, you still go to hardcore shows, and your still part of hardcore.
Straight Edge is a life style, its not an orginization
So if you wanna know more about straight edge, hardcore, or punk then look into it for yourself and dont let the media tell you what its about.
Id like to thank national geographic for giving what i live for a bad name,and
ruining our name
xXx
straight edge people really know how to kick some ass. i mean straight edge people don't do drinking or anything we just protect each other
straght edge's know how to woop ass i know this because i am a straight edge. the only reason why there is gang activity is to protect each other.
Kris you compared tiffany's usage of the word "turn" when she described how she "turned 4-5 people onto sxe and then saying that is comparable to turning people onto a gang. No offense but from your definition of "turn" you've just made every organized religeon in the world a gang since people get turned onto that movement. Or are sports gangs? because I remember when my father "turned" me onto baseball. Nice I guess I'm in a gang.
Kris you compared tiffany's usage of the word "turn" when she described how she "turned 4-5 people onto sxe and then saying that is comparable to turning people onto a gang. No offense but from your definition of "turn" you've just made every organized religeon in the world a gang since people get turned onto that movement. Or are sports gangs? because I remember when my father "turned" me onto baseball. Nice I guess I'm in a gang.
I'm 14 and 'Edge. I think this was an awesome documentary. It shows the Posi and Militant sides of Straight Edge. It was also sweet to see some of my favorite bands like THE FIRST STEP,HAVE HEART,and VERSE. Five out of Five, man. Well done.
Be True And Stay Alive
Drugs Are For Losers
XXX
I'm 14 and 'Edge. I think this was an awesome documentary. It shows the Posi and Militant sides of Straight Edge. It was also sweet to see some of my favorite bands like THE FIRST STEP,HAVE HEART,and VERSE. Five out of Five, man. Well done.
Be True And Stay Alive
Drugs Are For Losers
XXX
Everybody acts like FSU and Straight Edge is something so big. Not that big a deal. Why doesn't somebody do a report on something we can learn about that has bearing on life.
what the f88888 is all the little kid boston crap? I am 42 years old my days as a skin were straight edge which meant having a purpose and a lifestyle not a fad on tv. whers my fred perry? old school is kewl but some of us have been this way for 30 years boys and gurls. didnt stand up if there are so many of you and kick the immigrant to the curb(stomp) they have taken over and outbreed u 3 to one. and its ok to interbreed so there will be no straiht edge folx so take your outfits back to hot topic and go back to being a choir boy in suburbia. such a life leads to death or prison so wake up. visit your daddy in prison and let him tell you where the arayans are. straight edge! ha!
seriously, thanks national geographic now every kid who decides to abstain is automatically in a gang. You said in the beginning of the series that the militant side of edge was like 2% THEN YOU ONLY FOUCUS ON THAT 2% FOR THE REST OF THE F******* SERIES.... you are stupid. straight edge is a youth backed movement and life style (loosely related to a religion) yes their are some militants but thanks to your documentary the entire edge movement has a negative and ganglike conotation that goes with it.
You have helped ruin something good for kids, so many people have been helped by this way of life.
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